My personal blog about the random things that are in my life: writing, knitting, and substitute teaching.
Showing posts with label argument. Show all posts
Showing posts with label argument. Show all posts
Friday, November 30, 2018
Not a Word
"That hurted me."
Tenth grade English. It was the Friday before Thanksgiving break. They had a project having to do with Macbeth, and so they were talking and working.
If I had a dollar for every time a student used the word "hurted", I would not need to sub. Normally, I don't say anything about it. There are many of them who are English language learners, and I don't feel the need to correct every one of their grammar errors.
However, this didn't start with me. Another student pointed out that "hurted" isn't a word.
The boy who had said it said of course it was.
Um, no. No, it's not proper usage. And now it was time for me to jump in and point that out.
Oh no. He apparently knows English usage better than I do. He informed me that it was correct.
We went back and forth. I told him to go ahead and look it up. He got out his phone. He found this entry from Wiktionary...
And somehow he seemed to think this proved his point. I asked him what century we were in. He got it right on the second try. I pointed out the "archaic" part.
Still, he would not be dissuaded.
Okay, fine. You can't convince someone who won't be persuaded by proof. So, I walked away.
I did, however, make a point of telling the teacher all about this at the end of the day. (She was on campus, so she returned to the room after school.) I mean, it's an English class, after all. Teaching proper usage is part of her job.
She knew exactly who I was talking about. And I have a feeling "hurted" is going to be on the agenda upon their return from Thanksgiving break. If only I could be a fly on the wall on that day...
(If you want a good laugh, look up "hurted" on Urban Dictionary. Apparently this issue is more widespread than I thought.)
Friday, September 14, 2018
Familiar Request
Eleventh grade U.S. history. I had just gone over their assignment and asked for questions.
"Can we move seats and work with a partner?"
I should mention that this was already on the board...
No other class had bothered to ask. This is the teacher's handwriting, by the way, not mine. He had written up their assignment along with these instructions.
I pointed out this as I told the student no.
"Can we work in groups?"
Well, that's just messing with me.
"Mr. L isn't here. We don't have to tell him. You can let us..."
I'm familiar with this argument. I hear it a couple times a month. It's generally partnered with, "This is your class for today".
Me: "This is Mr. L's class, so we're going to honor his request."
I wonder if the boy does ever convince a sub to go along with that. Some must fall for it as the students use it frequently.
Once denied, though, the students didn't argue the point any longer. They settled into blissful silence. Ah. That's the kind of class I like.
Thursday, January 4, 2018
The Bickersons
We're still on winter break. School starts back on Monday. I've been holding my posts from the week before the break until when school starts up again. So, for today it's time for another #ThrowbackThursday. This post is from January 20, 2012.
Today I covered 8th grade science. The teacher has been out all week (his son's been sick). Today ended up being a finish-yesterday's-assignment day (I guess yesterday's sub made a mess of things...).
I explained what needed to get done to each class. Then I sat back and waited for where my presence was needed. In 3rd period, I didn't have to go far.
A boy and a girl sat at the table right next to the teacher's table. Everything started innocuously enough. The girl hid the boy's reading book. When the boy didn't notice its absence, the girl pointed out that he was missing something.
8th grade science is physical science. The class was doing work related to the periodic table. The boy and girl were on task. The girl had some questions.
I showed the girl where she could find what state each element was in (at room temperature) on the periodic table. She then checked for each element on the assignment. The boy made fun of her for double checking.
Chlorine? The boy knew that was liquid. He was wrong: gas. The girl then went after the boy for being wrong. Actually, she went after him for being wrong about everything. (For the record, he wasn't. He was wrong about half the time. She was wrong the other half.)
There was bickering over why she needed a new saxophone. The boy was shocked that the girl wasn't sure that copper was a metal (she was double checking, she said). And on it went.
I asked them if they bickered like that every day. I wouldn't think a teacher would put two people next to each other who irritated each other so much.
(I considered telling them to date and get it over with, but that only leads to vehement denials. I know this. From experience.)
It was kind of entertaining to watch. Does that make me a bad person?
Sadly, I have no idea if these two ended up dating. They would have graduated in 2016. (And I don't recall who they were even if this was recent enough for me to be able to find them again.) Ah well.
Friday, December 8, 2017
The Easy Way
"Look at this. We have to write all this down. It's too much work. I'm going to drop out."
10th grade world history. The assignment the boy was referring to was something about PowerPoint notes. It was two full pages long (or front and back of one page). In the grand scheme of things, it wasn't huge.
However, it was more than the boy wanted to do.
His friend, sitting next to him, concurred.
"You know [I forget who he named] dropped out, and look at him now."
I responded much as you'd expect. The gist was "stay in school". When I pointed out that most dropouts don't end up famous (or even comfortable), the boys responded with, "You don't think I can make it?"
Deep sigh.
Sophomores...
They explained their plans. They want to be YouTube famous. (I did point out that they could be in school and make YouTube videos on the side. I did point out that becoming YouTube famous wasn't a sure thing and/or all that easy. You can imagine how they responded to that.)
Ah well. It's better than planning on becoming a drug dealer.
Friday, November 10, 2017
Simultaneous Generation of Ideas
Middle school graphic arts class. Because there was a sub, they were stuck doing bookwork. (And they didn't like that one bit. Let's just say it was an "interesting" day.)
Their assignment was to read an article about the guy who invented Flamin' Hot Cheetos (a snack many of them consume daily), answer some questions, and then:
| Click on pic to make it bigger. |
One of the classes was actually on task. They discussed ideas. (One table discussed grilled cheese ice cream. Ick!) And then one boy accused a girl of stealing his idea.
That was my cue to intervene.
The boy showed me his idea. Ramen noodles with bacon. (The kiddos are obsessed with bacon.) He explained that he went to show the girl (who was seated at a different table), and her idea was the same.
Only, it wasn't. She was doing a noodle thing as well, but it was something about double the noodles. No bacon involved. Because they were both noodles, the boy said they were the same.
I explained that the ideas were different. The girl hadn't stolen his idea. Assuming that they hadn't been in communication before drawing their pictures, they had stumbled upon the simultaneous generation of ideas, or multiple discovery. I talked movies, but if you Google those terms, you get all sorts of interesting articles.
The boy, however, continued to claim the girl had stolen his idea. As he was just complaining, I walked away and let him be. At a certain point, I'm not going to change his mind. And if he's not disturbing anyone (other than them having to listen to his continuous complaint), it's a waste of my time to continue to argue.
At the end of the period, I collected their work. As I neatened up the pile, I found that the boy hadn't turned in his work. After all that, he doesn't turn it in?
Middle schoolers. *shakes head*
Wednesday, April 12, 2017
Justification
I was back in the middle school ELD class. (She's a new teacher, so she has a lot of trainings that the district makes her attend.) They were mostly on task and mostly quiet. But a new problem has emerged...
I caught a girl popping something into her mouth.
Eating in class is generally prohibited. (Some teachers are more lax on this than others.) I went over to remind the girl of the rule...
"The rules say no food, drink, or gum," she explained.
This is true. The sign posted in the classroom said as much.
"This is candy."
Uh huh. And candy is food...
"No, it's not food, it's candy."
We went back and forth on this a couple times. My explaining that she was not supposed to eat anything in class getting us nowhere. But then...
"Oh, no, it's not candy. It's a cough drop..."
Uh huh. Sure it is. And she can explain why it only became a cough drop after this argument to her teacher.
Oh, and keep in mind that she did eat the candy...
Do you remember your middle school (junior high school) years? (That's ages 12-13.) What's the silliest thing you ever argued?
Today's A to Z Challenge post brought to you by the letter...
Thursday, February 18, 2016
Bargaining for Five Stars
The conversation from yesterday's post did not quite end there...
Eventually, the girl let the listening to music issue go. Primarily because others in the class urged her to. I wasn't really paying attention at that point. But something one of the boys said perked my ears right up.
The boy informed the girl that I do, indeed, leave notes for the teacher. And they are detailed notes.
After some prompting, he informed me that he had been in the class I covered the previous day. Algebra 2.
You may have noticed that I have not posted a story about them. It's because I had no good stories about them. How can I possibly make a story about a class that worked silently without me having to do anything besides pass out the assignment interesting?
So, I didn't think my note to the previous day's teacher was all that detailed. What more was there to say other than the classes did what they were supposed to do?
The boy told me that Ms. C had gone over my remarks. He explained to the girl that I gave the classes a rating.
The girl now wanted to know what sort of rating her class would get. I looked around the room. They all appeared to be on task. (They were doing a timeline of World War II.) They were talking, but I hadn't asked for silence. So, I told her they'd get a 4 out of a possible 5.
The girl felt they should get a 5. I explained that 5s are earned for silent classes. But as I hadn't asked for silence, they wouldn't be in trouble for a 4. She countered that since I hadn't asked for silence and they were all on task, they should get the top score.
I wonder what line of work she's going to go into. Because she certainly argued well.
Not that I gave the class a 5. Each number means something, a something that I include with my note. But she was entertaining.
Thursday, September 24, 2015
The Debate
7th period math. They were just getting started on their computers when I noticed they weren't on their assigned computers. I informed them that they were to be in assigned seats.
"Why can't I sit here? All the computers are the same."
True. But teachers assign seats so students will work. Some students can't be trusted to sit next to friends. This is not what I said, however.
"You have assigned seats in this class. You need to be in your assigned seats."
"But Mr. F isn't here."
"This is still his class, so we'll abide by his rules."
And still he argued the point. I'm not sure why. I don't think I was wavering in my resolve. But I guess I seem like I'm open to debate. So, at this point I shut it down.
He reluctantly said he'd move. Said he had to shut down the computer...
Which is an old stalling tactic. Student says he's doing what was asked of him, but it's going to take a minute. I go deal with something else to give him time to comply. Five minutes later, he's still there, now entrenched, and the battle starts again. "You're serious? But you left. I'm doing well, so please let me be..."
The phone rang. Guess who they were calling for. He was being picked up at the main office and was going home for the day.
Saved by the call.
I got off the phone and told him he was leaving. His first reaction was to argue--he thought I was sending him out of class.
After he left, I went to shut down his computer. Had he even begun to log off? Nope. He was logging on, not off.
I'm so glad I didn't have to continue to fight that battle. I would have won, but it was nice not to have to put in the effort.
Wednesday, November 19, 2014
A Rule Change
I was back at the continuation high school for the first time since September, and I noticed a major change. Every student (practically) had a backpack. Huh?
I mentioned previously that backpacks were not allowed on campus. And one student took exception to that rule. (Please do glance at this post from August. I don't often get to follow up on the results of something.)
Ms. M stopped by her class during the prep period, and I had a chance to ask her about everyone now having backpacks. She told me that it was Juan that got the rule changed.
At a previous staff meeting, Juan presented his argument. Ms. M said it was well reasoned. He brought in a backpack and pulled out the stuff that he said students would want to carry--deodorant (for PE days), food (because they always seem to be eating), pens (which previously no student seemed to carry), and other stuff that students usually carry.
As for students bringing in stuff they shouldn't (like drugs or weapons), Juan agreed that searches could be permitted. (And this meant that the girls' purses would be open to the same searches.) They discussed either random searches or daily searches (like at concerts when they glance through the bags when people enter).
The teachers voted, and they approved allowing backpacks.
And now they're all carrying them. Which is actually good, because now they all seem to have pens with them so they can do their work. (Yep, before basically no one carried anything to write with. It was as big a nightmare as you can imagine.)
Which goes to prove--if you present a well-reasoned well-argued request to the proper authorities, you can effect change.
Friday, October 31, 2014
Who to Pick?
I've been dithering about, trying to figure out who I was going to blog about today. And it's hard. Because I have two great candidates.
It was Friday in a biology class, and they had a test. Well, it was more of a quiz. And for the most part, the classes behaved well (except for 5th period, but they were awful in the usual way). So, I was stumped as to how I was going to make a blog post out of it.
But, there were two interesting students. I don't know that either of them deserves a full blog post, though.
In 3rd period there was Nia. When she saw the quiz, she announced loudly that she knew nothing on it. (It was 11 questions: 5 multiple choice questions, 4 true/false questions, and 2 short answer questions.) The class got to work, and I didn't think too much more about Nia.
Then, as I was walking the room, I found Nia stretched out across her desk, head down in a pose of one who is most put upon. There were sighs coming from her direction. I intervened when she started drumming on her desk.
About the time when half the class had finished, I found Nia rifling through her notebook. With her biology notes.
I took her quiz and walked away.
Nia protested. She wasn't finished. Then what was she doing in her notebook? She explained that she was looking for some homework to complete for when she had finished her quiz.
So many things wrong with that explanation I don't know where to start.
Then in 4th period I got into a conversation with Brandon. (This was after everyone had finished the quiz and they were supposed to be working on a worksheet which I gave them.)
It started out as what seemed like a joke. Brandon explained that all he wanted to do with his life was become a drug dealer. As the conversation progressed, I became more and more convinced that he was serious.
Just picture me shaking my head.
On the bright side, aside from 5th period these were the problems of the day. So, in all, not too bad.
How do you convince a 14-year-old boy that he can do more with his life than become a drug dealer?
Wait. I know the answer to this one...
It was Friday in a biology class, and they had a test. Well, it was more of a quiz. And for the most part, the classes behaved well (except for 5th period, but they were awful in the usual way). So, I was stumped as to how I was going to make a blog post out of it.
But, there were two interesting students. I don't know that either of them deserves a full blog post, though.
In 3rd period there was Nia. When she saw the quiz, she announced loudly that she knew nothing on it. (It was 11 questions: 5 multiple choice questions, 4 true/false questions, and 2 short answer questions.) The class got to work, and I didn't think too much more about Nia.
Then, as I was walking the room, I found Nia stretched out across her desk, head down in a pose of one who is most put upon. There were sighs coming from her direction. I intervened when she started drumming on her desk.
About the time when half the class had finished, I found Nia rifling through her notebook. With her biology notes.
I took her quiz and walked away.
Nia protested. She wasn't finished. Then what was she doing in her notebook? She explained that she was looking for some homework to complete for when she had finished her quiz.
So many things wrong with that explanation I don't know where to start.
Then in 4th period I got into a conversation with Brandon. (This was after everyone had finished the quiz and they were supposed to be working on a worksheet which I gave them.)
It started out as what seemed like a joke. Brandon explained that all he wanted to do with his life was become a drug dealer. As the conversation progressed, I became more and more convinced that he was serious.
Just picture me shaking my head.
On the bright side, aside from 5th period these were the problems of the day. So, in all, not too bad.
How do you convince a 14-year-old boy that he can do more with his life than become a drug dealer?
Wait. I know the answer to this one...
Friday, August 1, 2014
The Backpack Scandal
Never argue with a teenager. It doesn't matter how many reasonable, well-thought-out points you make. If they feel they are right, nothing you say will convince them otherwise.
It was Friday at the continuation high school. The counselor followed Juan into the room to retrieve his backpack. She left with two.
(The continuation high school does not permit backpacks. I've always assumed the ban was to discourage the bringing of weapons and/or drugs to campus, considering the makeup of the student body.)
Juan was incensed. It was one of those drawstring bags (kind of like this one), and it only contained a folder, his cell phone charger, his keys, and some hand sanitizer. (Which he pulled out before the bag was taken away. Which he could retrieve at the end of the day.)
Why, Juan wanted to know, couldn't he bring that to school when girls are allowed to bring purses?
And he grilled me on this.
(Because I am somehow responsible?)
After ten minutes of his haranguing, I explained that complaining to me about this policy was about as useful as arguing with the wall.
The policy is, I agree, a bit sexist. I understand the distinction, but the girls do take advantage of the purse exception. Some of them carry bags that hold about as much as a backpack does. But there are some things that a girl does need a purse for.
I tried to argue the distinction with Juan, but he shot down every one of my points. I don't know why I bothered. Even if I could find a good argument, Juan would have found a way to argue against it.
(This is not the first time I've been in this sort of situation.)
Somehow the class finally settled. But Juan was still upset. He decided to write a letter to the principal. He even suggested starting a petition and asked his classmates if they'd sign it. Even the girl in the room with the offending purse agreed.
I did not know Juan was writing this letter until he brought it over to me. He asked me to read it. I offered a few notes. (I checked the grammar. It was a bit rambly and had just a basic argument, but it made his point, so I told him it was "good".) By the end of the period he had it ready and he said he was going to take it to the office.
It'll be interesting to see if he gets anywhere with this. (It's within the realm of possibility that he could get the administration to make some sort of a change. Probably not everything he wants. Several policies have changed in the past, so it's possible.)
It was Friday at the continuation high school. The counselor followed Juan into the room to retrieve his backpack. She left with two.
(The continuation high school does not permit backpacks. I've always assumed the ban was to discourage the bringing of weapons and/or drugs to campus, considering the makeup of the student body.)
Juan was incensed. It was one of those drawstring bags (kind of like this one), and it only contained a folder, his cell phone charger, his keys, and some hand sanitizer. (Which he pulled out before the bag was taken away. Which he could retrieve at the end of the day.)
Why, Juan wanted to know, couldn't he bring that to school when girls are allowed to bring purses?
And he grilled me on this.
(Because I am somehow responsible?)
After ten minutes of his haranguing, I explained that complaining to me about this policy was about as useful as arguing with the wall.
The policy is, I agree, a bit sexist. I understand the distinction, but the girls do take advantage of the purse exception. Some of them carry bags that hold about as much as a backpack does. But there are some things that a girl does need a purse for.
I tried to argue the distinction with Juan, but he shot down every one of my points. I don't know why I bothered. Even if I could find a good argument, Juan would have found a way to argue against it.
(This is not the first time I've been in this sort of situation.)
Somehow the class finally settled. But Juan was still upset. He decided to write a letter to the principal. He even suggested starting a petition and asked his classmates if they'd sign it. Even the girl in the room with the offending purse agreed.
I did not know Juan was writing this letter until he brought it over to me. He asked me to read it. I offered a few notes. (I checked the grammar. It was a bit rambly and had just a basic argument, but it made his point, so I told him it was "good".) By the end of the period he had it ready and he said he was going to take it to the office.
It'll be interesting to see if he gets anywhere with this. (It's within the realm of possibility that he could get the administration to make some sort of a change. Probably not everything he wants. Several policies have changed in the past, so it's possible.)
Wednesday, March 5, 2014
Not Going to Budge
The lesson plan was pretty emphatic about me making sure the students were all seated in their assigned seats according to the seating chart. While this is something I tend to enforce, the lesson plan made it clear that this was vital to the day's running of the class.
8th grade pre-algebra. Once they got seated, I went up and down the seating chart, calling out the names assigned to empty desks. Finding that many of those students were indeed seated elsewhere.
"But she moved me here."
There are times when the seating chart isn't up to date. The teacher may in fact have moved them. Then again, this may be the new lie--the lie that the students know we subs are more likely to believe.
"Fine. But for today, I'd like it if you'd sit here."
I used "please". I used "for today". I didn't accuse them of lying to me. I only asked them to sit where I asked them to sit for the one day.
One girl wouldn't budge. It felt like five minutes of her insisting that where she was was her seat, and my asking her to move was going to be the end of the world.
I asked her to move one seat, to the seat just in front of where she was already seated.
I wonder if the teacher had moved all the students without updating the seating chart. I also wonder if the students were just trying to sit where they wanted. Neither would surprise me. That class... Well, they were a handful.
8th grade pre-algebra. Once they got seated, I went up and down the seating chart, calling out the names assigned to empty desks. Finding that many of those students were indeed seated elsewhere.
"But she moved me here."
There are times when the seating chart isn't up to date. The teacher may in fact have moved them. Then again, this may be the new lie--the lie that the students know we subs are more likely to believe.
"Fine. But for today, I'd like it if you'd sit here."
I used "please". I used "for today". I didn't accuse them of lying to me. I only asked them to sit where I asked them to sit for the one day.
One girl wouldn't budge. It felt like five minutes of her insisting that where she was was her seat, and my asking her to move was going to be the end of the world.
I asked her to move one seat, to the seat just in front of where she was already seated.
I wonder if the teacher had moved all the students without updating the seating chart. I also wonder if the students were just trying to sit where they wanted. Neither would surprise me. That class... Well, they were a handful.
Monday, March 3, 2014
Stubborn
The 7th grade math class had a list of things to do. Homework. Packets. Test the next day. And a whole period in which to complete said assignments.
"Can we play a game?"
The teacher has a stack of games for them to play when they're finished with their work. So, I asked.
"But it's homework. That means I do it at home."
But she was in class and had time to do it in class. To finish it in class so she wouldn't be stuck with homework.
Knowing how kids think, I said that they could play games. Provided that they were finished with all their other work. And I would check.
(If I take their word for it, they'll all be "finished".)
I told the girl she could play a game. As soon as I saw all her completed work. She argued. She glared.
She spent all period doing nothing but talking to a neighbor. Her classmates took my challenge, showed me their work, and were granted game-playing privileges. The girl?
Well, I guess she really wanted to do it at home.
"Can we play a game?"
The teacher has a stack of games for them to play when they're finished with their work. So, I asked.
"But it's homework. That means I do it at home."
But she was in class and had time to do it in class. To finish it in class so she wouldn't be stuck with homework.
Knowing how kids think, I said that they could play games. Provided that they were finished with all their other work. And I would check.
(If I take their word for it, they'll all be "finished".)
I told the girl she could play a game. As soon as I saw all her completed work. She argued. She glared.
She spent all period doing nothing but talking to a neighbor. Her classmates took my challenge, showed me their work, and were granted game-playing privileges. The girl?
Well, I guess she really wanted to do it at home.
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